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Thread: Conversion of Spanish measurements into English measurements?

  1. #1

    Default Conversion of Spanish measurements into English measurements?

    Conversion of Spanish length, weight and space measurements into English length, weight and space measurements ?

    Since there is apparently a conversion option for spanish burgos feet to imperial feet...
    there is also a conversion of the spanish volume / weight
    "toneladas de desplazamiento" in english tons BM?

    Based on the misleading information on Wiki/threedecks.org/ etc., the question arises as to whether the information on the Spanish First Rates is partly Spanish toneladas.

    If these were different to the same degree as Burgos feet are from imperial feet, the values ​​would make at least some sense.

  2. #2

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    There are basically three size versions with small deviations from the Meregildos class of the Spanish Navy:

    Small (GD=190.0 to 197.0; Keel 152.11-176.10; Breadth= 54.3-56.0; Depth in Hold=23.1-28.0)
    Salvador del Mundo; San Jose; San Carlos

    Middle (GD=205,5 to 213,3; Keel 183.9-185.10; Breadth= 54.7-58.0; Depth in Hold=26,0-27.6)
    San Hermegildo; Real Carlos, Conde de Regla, Mejicano, Reina Luisa, Principe de Asturias, Santa Ana

    Large (GD=220,6; Keel 186,0 to 188,0; Breadth= 58,0 to 58,4; Depth in Hold=28,9 to 29,10)
    Purisima Conception and Santisima Trinidad

    Assuming Tons BM increases with size, the ships within the groups should be close together, right?

    The numbers in bold are available on threedecks.org and wiki.
    I'm just trying to use real numbers here.

    Maybe someone has other sources?

    small variant:
    Salvador del Mundo = 2397 (toneladas or tons BM???) I think toneladas (roughly 2100-2200 tons BM could fit)
    San Jose = 2456 (toneladas or tons BM???) I think toneladas (roughly 2150-2300 tons BM could fit)
    San Carlos = ??? (toneladas or tons BM) (roughly 2150-2300 tons BM could fit)

    medium variant:
    San Hermenegildo; Real Carlos; Conde de Regla; Mejicano = 2308 (toneladas or tons BM ? ) I think Tons BM
    Reina Luisa = 2308 (toneladas or tons BM ? ) I think Tons BM, but the ship is larger than its predecessors. (so more like the Principe de Asturias with 2453 t BM)
    Principe de Asturias = 2453 (toneladas or Tons BM???) I think tons BM
    Santa Ana = 2112 ??? That must be completely wrong!
    On a Spanish homepage there are other numbers: https://todoavante.es/index.php?title=Ana,_Santa_(1785)
    "2300 toneladas and 4800 de desplazamiento"
    Whatever that means...?
    In terms of size, the Santa Ana is slightly longer than the Principe des Asturias/Reina Luisa. Therefore, it must have at least these values.

    large variant:
    Purisima Conception = 2771 (tons BM or toneladas) I think tons BM
    Santisima Trinidad = 2475 (tons BM or toneladas) Since the Santisima was in any case the size of the Purisima Conception, it should also have the values...
    There must also be a transmission error or this is the original dimension for building the ship.So the Santisima would have to be more like 2700-2900 tons BM.

  3. #3
    Comptroller of the Navy Board
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    Not every yard used the same measurements... some yards used the Burgos foot, others the more archaic codo, some others yet another. See why I say Spanish measurement systems *alone* are the stuff of screaming nightmares?

    But yes, Salvador del Muno was the single smallest Meregildos and the only one we could find a plan for... and even relative to the smallest ship of the class the model still came out undersize and badly misshapen. :(

    Trinidad is no design relation to PC or Meregildos; though PC and M are close enough that I would be comfortable passing a sculpt of either off as the other in this game's scale.
    --Diamondback
    PMH, SME, TLA, BBB
    Historical Consultant to Ares, Wings and Sails - Unless otherwise noted, all comments are strictly Personal Opinion ONLY and not to be taken as official Company Policy.

  4. #4

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    I hope the new winfield will bring new insights...

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    As do I. Winfield was very good in the French volumes about providing metric equivalents for the Pied du Roi measurements, so hopefully that will continue here especially with one of the top minds in Spanish naval history as coauthor.

    The hardest part is the waiting... and were we actively developing anything, I would be advising Ares to table any further Spanish releases until the book is available for us to work from and start preparing to Errata all previous Armada releases.
    --Diamondback
    PMH, SME, TLA, BBB
    Historical Consultant to Ares, Wings and Sails - Unless otherwise noted, all comments are strictly Personal Opinion ONLY and not to be taken as official Company Policy.

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