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Thread: Next wave of ships

  1. #1

    Default Next wave of ships

    Anyone noticed the new ships at the Ares Games homepage?

    Seems that I get my Bucentaure class ships soon.

  2. #2
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    I did, sir Fortunately, I have a new French ship to hunt cargoships of East Indian Company

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  3. #3
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    Gentlemen, you now have one job to do since sales of these are going to have a direct impact on how much credence gives me and by extension this site:

    DO NOT MAKE A LIAR OF ME.

    :p
    --Diamondback
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    I don't think we have too much to worry about......

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    We are all right behind your choices DB. See my post on the other thread.
    This is what the Captains have been crying out for.
    Rob.
    The Business of the commander-in-chief is first to bring an enemy fleet to battle on the most advantageous terms to himself, (I mean that of laying his ships close on board the enemy, as expeditiously as possible); and secondly to continue them there until the business is decided.

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    Hmm I think Ill be getting one or two of this wave :)

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    I shall be buying some.

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    The Bucentaure class is indeed an important addition, making smaller SOL actions like Cape Ortegal 1805 possible.

    Also, with the 44-50 gun converted merchantmen group, a battle like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Cape_Henry is possible. The British 90 should be weaker than the currently available 100's, but the Duc de Bourgogne 80 is one of the last of the pre-Tonnant 80's, with only 18-pounders on the upper deck, so it should be weaker as well. Should cancel each other out.

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    I don't recall if it was Duc de Bourgogne I saw draughts for, but I do know that at least one pre-Tonnant French 80 looked close enough I'd consider the newer design's sculpt an acceptable fit.

    Breaking down the OrBat: (specifically-released ships in bold, similar "stretches" in italic)
    Rate British sculpted British unsculpted French sculpted French unsculpted
    1-2 three-decker London
    3 80-84-gunner Duc de Bourgogne
    3 74-gunner SGN104 Robust, Royal Oak, Bedford Citoyen 74: Conquerant
    one-off 74 Neptune
    3 64-gunner SGN114 America Exeter 64: Europe, Prudent SGN109 Eveille, Jason
    SGN114 Ardent
    (SGN109?) Provence
    4 50-gunner SGN110 Adamant
    5 44-gunner ex-UK Roebuck 44: Romulus
    5 32 frigate SGN103 Iris, Pearl SGN101 Hermione, Gentille
    6 28 post-ship (SGN103?) Enterprise 28: Medea Coventry 28: Guadeloupe
    U 14-gun Fantasque
    --Diamondback
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    Quote Originally Posted by Diamondback View Post
    I don't recall if it was Duc de Bourgogne I saw draughts for, but I do know that at least one pre-Tonnant French 80 looked close enough I'd consider the newer design's sculpt an acceptable fit.
    Interesting analysis, Diamondback. You basically show that we have 'approximate' models after release 4.

    I am actually more concerned about the right ship values. The Tonnant/Bucentaure class in French service (the British Tonnant is another matter) carried a 36-pounder lower and a 24-pounder upper battery. The Duc de Bourgogne had a similar 36-pounder lower battery, but only 18-pounders in her upper battery. Should make a difference.

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    A point well worth noting, Niek. I always start with getting the physical model right, we can always massage the numbers as needed and it's a lot easier and cheaper to print new paper than it is to rework an entire sculpt.

    Problem is, we don't really have very good stat separation in this game, it's hard to separate a 32/24 Large 74 from a 32/18 Middling, and the latter from a 32/18 Common. My best guess is DdB vs Tonnant statistically would be similar to Bellona vs Temeraire.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Diamondback View Post
    Problem is, we don't really have very good stat separation in this game
    DB achieves a level of understatement approaching an Englishman's level of proficiency

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    Quote Originally Posted by David Manley View Post
    DB achieves a level of understatement approaching an Englishman's level of proficiency
    It is unwise to unnecessarily and gratuitously insult those one seeks full-time employment with, wouldn't you agree? LOL
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    Quote Originally Posted by Diamondback View Post
    It is unwise to unnecessarily and gratuitously insult those one seeks full-time employment with, wouldn't you agree? LOL


    Rob.
    The Business of the commander-in-chief is first to bring an enemy fleet to battle on the most advantageous terms to himself, (I mean that of laying his ships close on board the enemy, as expeditiously as possible); and secondly to continue them there until the business is decided.

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    It looks like they are still suffering from the headsails being on the opposite tack from the spanker, like the Leopard and her gang. Nice model, though.

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    Pity that, but I realize that they must have been fairly well on in production before we had chance to flag up to Ares the mistakes on the last series.
    Rob.
    The Business of the commander-in-chief is first to bring an enemy fleet to battle on the most advantageous terms to himself, (I mean that of laying his ships close on board the enemy, as expeditiously as possible); and secondly to continue them there until the business is decided.

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    The downside of handing them a prepackaged release that just needs stats and sculpt? :(

    Though we also do have to give them credit for trying to address our concerns about release pacing... To be honest, unless they have Wave 5 already picked it could be a while, because I started "Project Jumpshot" as soon as they told me what had been selected for Wave 3 sculpts, so it was like having two sets in research at once between them and us working in parallel up to a point.
    Last edited by Diamondback; 04-27-2017 at 06:26.
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    I must admit that the turn round on the next wave astounded me.
    I was expecting about Spring next year.
    I will have to get some pennies together from somewhere PDQ.
    Rob.
    The Business of the commander-in-chief is first to bring an enemy fleet to battle on the most advantageous terms to himself, (I mean that of laying his ships close on board the enemy, as expeditiously as possible); and secondly to continue them there until the business is decided.

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    I hear that on budget, Rob... between Wave 4, finishing Wave 3, WGS BoB, next WGF... and oh by the way, one of my cop buddies and I are designing and building a prototype PDW/CQBW for his department in cases where sidearms aren't enough but full patrol-rifles are either overkill or attract too much unwanted attention, and half the parts we've specced out are all getting dumped on sale RIGHT NOW at the halfway-between-paydays mark! (AND I just found out that the handguard we selected to build this nasty little beast around is Discontinued, so while I have mine for the prototype we may need to redesign for the final "Official Issue" spec...) Anybody else's wallet having fun out there? Mine is most assuredly not... *quiet laugh*

    Yes, I know, I'm whining. Any of you guys seen my cheese tray?

    DB, who really needs to get to work on "Jumpshot II" if it's going to work for Wave 6... and who suggests that if we're trying for an encore performance, it might be prudent to draw up a double slate so that if anything from it shows up in Wave 5 we can just promote the next entries on the list
    --Diamondback
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    When do we get them in our hands?

    I am drooling already

    is there an advanced order ability through the Anchorage like we did for BoB on the Aerodrome?

    Ensign Patch ready to enlist these for games scenarios...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dobbs View Post
    It looks like they are still suffering from the headsails being on the opposite tack from the spanker, like the Leopard and her gang. Nice model, though.
    Maybe someone in the know could suggest to those in charge that they could use the headsail patterns from Wave 1 or 2 on the new ships to replace the reversed headsails (Before they make a bunch of them)?

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    Dobbs, at this point the Wave 4 ship has sailed, but I will push them *hard* for Waves 5 and beyond.
    --Diamondback
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  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ensign Patch View Post
    When do we get them in our hands?

    I am drooling already

    is there an advanced order ability through the Anchorage like we did for BoB on the Aerodrome?

    Ensign Patch ready to enlist these for games scenarios...
    Relax Simon.
    I expect Keith will have them up for pre order well before the due date.
    The Business of the commander-in-chief is first to bring an enemy fleet to battle on the most advantageous terms to himself, (I mean that of laying his ships close on board the enemy, as expeditiously as possible); and secondly to continue them there until the business is decided.

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    I'll be on board for at least two copies of each.

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    I have just bought my ship mats and plastic sleeves to do all 12 when they are released.
    Nothing like being one jump ahead Paul!
    Rob.
    The Business of the commander-in-chief is first to bring an enemy fleet to battle on the most advantageous terms to himself, (I mean that of laying his ships close on board the enemy, as expeditiously as possible); and secondly to continue them there until the business is decided.

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    Great news!
    I really wellcome the Indiamen and the Spanish frigates. I'm definitelly getting at least one Spanish Mahonesa Class Frigates, and two East Indiamen.
    I'll probably guy a Bucentaure-class, but I'm not sure about the 64-guns British Ships-of-the-Line

    Now I'm missing the Pirate ships! I was hopping for a Brigantine ... will we ever have Pirate ships?

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    Anything below 28m long, around 14 guns, is at present time and scale outside manufacturing capability for Ares. I asked when I was gathering criteria for "Jumpshot."
    --Diamondback
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    Since the Ardent class is making an appearance, would it the stuff of a fever dream fantasy to hope for an Indefatigable somewhere in the future?

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    Indefatigable might well be a suggestion for a future "special" ship.....

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    That would certainly put the icing on the cake as far as my British Fleet is concerned Dave.
    Rob.
    The Business of the commander-in-chief is first to bring an enemy fleet to battle on the most advantageous terms to himself, (I mean that of laying his ships close on board the enemy, as expeditiously as possible); and secondly to continue them there until the business is decided.

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    The problem is Indefatigable would have to be a unique sculpt; my memory could be failing me but I don't recall any other British 64-gun razees. Plenty of 74's, but they'd need to be reworked from SGN104 and be rather bigger.
    --Diamondback
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    Magnanime and Anson

    Anyway, if being an individual ship was a blocker wed never get Santissima Trinidad :)
    Last edited by David Manley; 05-06-2017 at 22:17.

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    The rub is, they're more up for it as an SP--we'll almost certainly never see a Mainline Release of Razee 64's, so I'm inclined to propose co-bundling the full log-sets for Anson and Magnanime into the proposed Indefatigable Special Pack.
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  34. #34
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    That does it for me DB. Three ships are always better than one.
    Rob.
    The Business of the commander-in-chief is first to bring an enemy fleet to battle on the most advantageous terms to himself, (I mean that of laying his ships close on board the enemy, as expeditiously as possible); and secondly to continue them there until the business is decided.

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    That was kind of the idea.....

    Special pack, sold as Indefatigable with Captain cards to reflect Pellew. Special bonus - also include cards t allow the ship to be used as the other two.

    So a Special pack with a longer "reach" than others.

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    But will it happen? We been waiting a while for the Santissima, before even the Spanish temeraires released.
    I hope Ares take up the suggestion as it sounds like a plan to me and
    I would certainly purchase three so as to have all three named ships and Im pretty sure I would not be alone in this.
    Last edited by Capn Duff; 05-07-2017 at 16:21.

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    I would be quietly hopeful.......

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    I am looking forward to getting at least one of each of this wave, I have to save for WGF, X-Wing, Imperial Assault too! - so first come, first served!

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    One quick question for you Richard.
    Do you intend to add separate solo movement charts for the eighties, sixty fours, and Fifties?
    Or will these ships be near enough to use the 74 Chart? which is what I am doing at the present.
    Rob.
    The Business of the commander-in-chief is first to bring an enemy fleet to battle on the most advantageous terms to himself, (I mean that of laying his ships close on board the enemy, as expeditiously as possible); and secondly to continue them there until the business is decided.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bligh View Post
    One quick question for you Richard.
    Do you intend to add separate solo movement charts for the eighties, sixty fours, and Fifties?
    Or will these ships be near enough to use the 74 Chart? which is what I am doing at the present.
    Rob.
    I will have to look at the charts, but envision the 74 chart will work well enough. I found in one game I used the 74 chart for frigates and never noticed!!!

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    It certainly seems to have worked fine for the three games that I have played so far with the 60s, and the Frigate movement works equally well for the 50s. So I would agree that we probably do not need to worry overmuch.
    Rob.
    The Business of the commander-in-chief is first to bring an enemy fleet to battle on the most advantageous terms to himself, (I mean that of laying his ships close on board the enemy, as expeditiously as possible); and secondly to continue them there until the business is decided.

  42. #42

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    Somehow the gunport designs changed...

    Here are the pictures of Commerce de Bordeaux and Bucentaure.
    Attached Images Attached Images   

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    Ooooooohhhhh looking at the base positioning, the Bucentaure is smaller than the Commerse........ dejavu here
    Last edited by Capn Duff; 05-10-2017 at 08:37.

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    Oh, FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU[bleep] Here we go again...

    Query out to RdM, waiting for reply.
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    Sorreeee but by my reconing, using the reference books I have, Bucentaur should be around 3m longer which is 3mm longer than the Commerse, I could handle being the same size, but looking at the picture of both models together Bucentaure is visibly shorter.
    Dont think its my eyes, but will happily be proved incorrect here.

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    That could well be the end of my eighties dream!
    Rob.
    The Business of the commander-in-chief is first to bring an enemy fleet to battle on the most advantageous terms to himself, (I mean that of laying his ships close on board the enemy, as expeditiously as possible); and secondly to continue them there until the business is decided.

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    Chris, also bear in mind those photos are not a direct comparison--angles are different, but I agree Bucentaure does appear underlength.

    ARE YOU 1/1200-OR-BUST TWITS OUT THERE FINALLY HAPPY NOW THAT YOU'VE F***ED THINGS UP FOR THE REST OF US?!\

    Ares had one job. ONE. JOB! And I specifically CAUTIONED them to check sculpt lengths against "Expected Values"... We are SO screwed. It was fun while it lasted, guys, but it's looking like time to start keepin' one hand on the Loud Handle...
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    Yes understand about angles etc DB, I sincerely hope Im wrong here and it is a matter of angles, but look at the bow of both models, then the stern, then compare the forward red firing arc on both and where the model sits. Looks plainly smaller to me.
    Cant say anything about the rest of the wave but I know the 80 gunners should be at least the same size as the Temeraire models at this scale if they following the same scale.

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    Chris, even with the different angles I agree--Bucentaure distinctly has a problem, and I'm annoyed now because this was *my* project.

    You guys lose a tabletop toy, I lose a tangible item I could have shown to prospective employers/clients and say "I helped make THIS happen." :(

    If the rest of the wave's like this...
    https://youtu.be/vXLLH1eSOZE?t=71
    --Diamondback
    PMH, SME, TLA, BBB
    Historical Consultant to Ares, Wings and Sails - Unless otherwise noted, all comments are strictly Personal Opinion ONLY and not to be taken as official Company Policy.

  50. #50
    Stats Committee
    Master & Commander
    United States

    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Maryland
    Log Entries
    1,987
    Blog Entries
    13
    Name
    Dobbs

    Default

    I'd say it's a win for Ares, 'cause now I'm going to have to buy 2 Temeraires to follow in Jonas' footsteps building a Tonnant!

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