Sails of Glory Game mat

[Comte de Brueys]

From the Kickstarter:

Game Mat Option - You may add $ 20 to your pledge (Canadian backers must add $5, International backers must add $ 10 to cover shipping charges) to request the Game Mat option. If multiple game mats are requested, shipping charges are only due once.This option is expected to ship in August, 2013

I hope the new SoG game mats fits to the sea color of the WoG gaming mat.

Would be ok, if there is a SoG logo on it, but I hope Ares don't add sunk wrecks or other gimmicks like a treasure island etc... :hmmm:

I badly need some nice looking sea mats for my WGS miniatures from the Pacific theater and for my French fleet of course. :smack:



Any informations, how the sea mats will look like?

[The Royal Hajj]

I think we will have images of the artwork some time next week, or early the week after that. There is not going to be any land on this initial mat, just open sea. There will of course be the SGN logo and a very light grid pattern on it to help with wind directions.

[Horatio]

Will be interested to see it and if it will fit in with the Wings of Glory mats.

[7eat51]

I hope Ares don't add sunk wrecks... and for my French fleet of course. :smack:

I thought you didn't want any sunken ships? :wink:

[Diamondback]

:smack:

Whoa, cool! Nobody told me we have our own Gibbs-slap emoticon! :D

[The Royal Hajj]

Will be interested to see it and if it will fit in with the Wings of Glory mats.

While it will physically fit with the Wings mats, I don't think it will visually fit very well. Even if the blue is the same color, the light grid markings would throw it off in my opinion.

[Comte de Brueys]

I thought you didn't want any sunken ships? :wink:


You're right, Eric. I don't like sunk ships. :sly:

The best end for a French ship is a) to be blown up or b) to be captured and renamed by the Brits :wink:

[David Manley]

"There is not going to be any land on this initial mat"

the impression I've got from various chats is that "terrain" (be it islands, coastlines or shallows) will be handled by overlays which I think, even if we are only talking thick card, will look better than flat printing on a mat. There are alsready a number of suitable terrian items available, from plastic and resin island to expanded polystyrene coastines and cliffs. And of course it gives free reign to those terrain modellers who want to make their own "spectaculars".

I would not rule out a mat printed with coasts and islands, but I think it would be fairly low on the list of priorities. Something with varying areas of blue (similar to the WSIM board as someone lese posted recently) to allow areas to be declared as "shallow" would be rather more useful, I think.

[The Royal Hajj]

I agree with David, we may see some "terrained" mats later on, but not any time soon.

[Berthier]

I agree with David, we may see some "terrained" mats later on, but not any time soon.

Pity, I really like the printed appearance of WSIM and Ironclads where shoals, coasts, rivers etc can all be displayed on a single map with the various shaded contours. Still, not hard to do terrain for naval warfare so not a major issue.

[The Royal Hajj]

Pity, I really like the printed appearance of WSIM and Ironclads where shoals, coasts, rivers etc can all be displayed on a single map with the various shaded contours. Still, not hard to do terrain for naval warfare so not a major issue.

They are doing those in the form of the Terrain Packs. That way you can put those shoals and coast wherever you want each and every game.

[7eat51]

I'm a bit confused by the last few posts. When discussing the mats, is there a difference in terminology between land masses of any sort and different shades of blue? When it is stated that terrain oriented mats might be offered later, are we talking about mats with land masses, mats with different shades of blue, or both?

I would prefer mats that have different shades of blue and no land masses, reserving any form of land mass to be an extra one places upon the mats.

[Berthier]

Thanks Keith I know about terrain packs, they looked a little cheesy on the KS page, but I suppose these are prototypes.

[Berthier]

I'm a bit confused by the last few posts. When discussing the mats, is there a difference in terminology between land masses of any sort and different shades of blue? When it is stated that terrain oriented mats might be offered later, are we talking about mats with land masses, mats with different shades of blue, or both?

I would prefer mats that have different shades of blue and no land masses, reserving any form of land mass to be an extra one places upon the mats.

Yes Eric, exactly my preferences as well :salute:

[Jack Aubrey]

I'm a bit confused by the last few posts. When discussing the mats, is there a difference in terminology between land masses of any sort and different shades of blue? When it is stated that terrain oriented mats might be offered later, are we talking about mats with land masses, mats with different shades of blue, or both?

I would prefer mats that have different shades of blue and no land masses, reserving any form of land mass to be an extra one places upon the mats.

Yes, exactly.:drinks:

[The Royal Hajj]

I don't know what direction Ares is going with future mats, but I think it will be mats with actual coast lines and such on them. So that you could build the outline of a land mass with perhaps a river feeding into a bay... perfect for cutting out actions or coast defense forts... both of which have been play tested from day one of the games design. I also think that a multi shaded blue mat could be an option. It all just depends on how well the game and any official accessories for it sale.


Thanks Keith I know about terrain packs, they looked a little cheesy on the KS page, but I suppose these are prototypes.

Yes, that is a horrible image they put up on the page. Fortunately, it is just concept art and in no way reflects what the finished pieces will look like. The last I hear, the same artist that did the Wings mats is doing the Terrain Pack artwork. The styles should be similar, so the final product will look really good. Hopefully they will get some real artwork up very soon.

[Comte de Brueys]

Ineresting information First Sealord.

Depending on the actual picture I thougt the terrain pieces are only simple gray plastic templates.

[The Royal Hajj]

Yes, I'm afraid a lot of people have thought that. Ares has really upped their commitment in the art department and I do not see them releasing anything that is not very nice looking at the least.

[7eat51]

Yes, I'm afraid a lot of people have thought that. Ares has really upped their commitment in the art department and I do not see them releasing anything that is not very nice looking at the least.

I encourage Ares to more clearly state such things on the KS page. Without the proper info, people will assume the worse far too often.

[Sea Gull]

Maybe they can put some pretty pictures up on the KS page after the GAMA event. It's the difference between a pre-prototype ship and the production version. Even if it's at the concept art stage, something to show the quality we can expect from the mat and the terrain pack may go a long way to help further the KS. Actually I'm just really curious and want to know ... now, what everything will look like. this is why I don't build ships, no bl##dy patience.:angry::smack::sad:

[RichardPF]

From the KS page with my added bold and italic:

------------------


at $ 140,000 we will be able to fully fund the design and production of the Terrain Pack #1. The Terrain Pack #1 is a set of 4 die-cut cardboard punched boards, including 5 modular stretches of coast and 9 sandbanks. These terrain elements are perfect for use together with our Game Mat. The Terrain Pack #1 is FREE OF CHARGE to all pledge levels from Lieutenant up, and is available as a $5 option together with any reward level (or if you want more than one).

-------------------

Based on the description and the price for additional copies and for pledge levels less than Lieutenant, as compared to say a ship model, I can see why people might get the impression that this was not the most "high end" item.

[The Royal Hajj]

Actually, it says it is a concept drawing right under the image ;)

[DeRuyter]

I'm a bit confused by the last few posts. When discussing the mats, is there a difference in terminology between land masses of any sort and different shades of blue? When it is stated that terrain oriented mats might be offered later, are we talking about mats with land masses, mats with different shades of blue, or both?

I would prefer mats that have different shades of blue and no land masses, reserving any form of land mass to be an extra one places upon the mats.

My preference as well.

[Sea Gull]

Actually, it says it is a concept drawing right under the image ;)

:erk::embarass: I hope you know what I meant when I wrote what I didn't mean. :pray:

[Capt P]

Great to see what is happening with SoG. I do think the mats will be able to mate with the WoG mats. Will be a great addition.

[The Barrelman]

Anyone lucky enough to demo SoG yet (GAMA maybe) with the game mat? Just wondering if it will really be comfortable to field 4 ships on one with terrain and other accessories.

[The Royal Hajj]

I'm running my first review/demo game tomorrow night. It looks like we will have 4-6 players. With out any mats to play on, we will be playing on a 4x6 table, but I'll make note of how much room we really use.

[RichardPF]

I'm running my first review/demo game tomorrow night. It looks like we will have 4-6 players. With out any mats to play on, we will be playing on a 4x6 table, but I'll make note of how much room we really use.

Do you tend to play Wings on a surfce as wide as 4'?

[Beowulf03809]

We typically play XWing, which has much longer per-turn movement reach (perhaps 8" with average being maybe 4" - 6") on a 3x3 surface. We've used up to fighters per side on that size, with "terrain" (asteroids). I was actually surprised by that myself since my other (troop based) gaming experiences normally used a 4x6 or 4x8 table but we found that when things do get crowded on the 3x3 it is actually pretty themed and exciting. It changed my perspective (not having in WoG experience myself yet this is the closest I can compare).

I could see potentially four ships per side being played on a roughly 4x4 mat in SoG considering the shorter movement per turn and that you really want to get in close for that Nelson Touch. Larger tables and you'll probably spend two or three turns just closing without adding anything to the game play and risking frustration of players if wind is really against one side. Larger fleets would require additional space but I don't think a large surface for just a few ships would be enjoyable.

[Cmmdre]

I'm running my first review/demo game tomorrow night. It looks like we will have 4-6 players. With out any mats to play on, we will be playing on a 4x6 table, but I'll make note of how much room we really use.

If you had 6 feet of coastline with batteries and 4 feet of coastal waters shoals, inlets etc I could see that as a great test. :envy:

[7eat51]

Almost all of our WoG games have been on a surface the size of two mats. This gave us ample room for maneuvering, story creating, etc., without too much delay before action. As previously mentioned, when things get crowded, it has been to good effect.

Given that the combat range of SoG seems to be the same as WoG, I imagine two mats would suffice for most smaller engagements. The one thing I see as a bit different is that in Age of Sail, there is more proclivity to pursue. But that can be handled quite easily by rotating mats or shifting ships.

[Andy Blozinski]

I could a' sworn I saw somewhere the map was 27"x39", but it says this nowhere on the kickstarter site all. That's kind of an important detail to have left out.
If they really are that size, I'm thinking on going with three maps now. I'm wondering if the game will work well enough for everyone to play two ships. I'd need to open it up some with the nubmer of plaers I want to handle for a convention.

[Cmmdre]

I could a' sworn I saw somewhere the map was 27"x39", but it says this nowhere on the kickstarter site all. That's kind of an important detail to have left out.
If they really are that size, I'm thinking on going with three maps now. I'm wondering if the game will work well enough for everyone to play two ships. I'd need to open it up some with the nubmer of plaers I want to handle for a convention.

You are correct with the dimensions of 27"x 39". That can be clicked on the KS site which takes you to another Ares site, Facebook I think. Ares states that the SoG mat are similar to WoG mats.

[7eat51]

I could a' sworn I saw somewhere the map was 27"x39", but it says this nowhere on the kickstarter site all. That's kind of an important detail to have left out.
If they really are that size, I'm thinking on going with three maps now. I'm wondering if the game will work well enough for everyone to play two ships. I'd need to open it up some with the nubmer of plaers I want to handle for a convention.

If SoG is anything like WoG, it is amazing how much can be done on two mats. When I first saw WoG mat dimensions, I thought they were pretty small. Then I played some games using two mats. They actually can handle quite a few planes. I am looking forward to the Royal Hajj's report on his SoG game and how space worked.

I wish we could see a picture as to the grid that will be on the mats. I am hoping these will be o.k. to add onto WoG maps, i.e. that the grid will not detract too much.

[The Barrelman]

Hope you don't mind me quoting from your Kickstarter comment Keith.


I just ran a review game with 6 players (2 SOL and 4 Frigs.) on a 4x6 foot table and we had PLENTY of room. Perhaps to much really for the ships... not for the players! lol I think two mats is going to be the sweet size for most 4-6 ship games. For more then 6 ships (or 6 + players), I'd want to go to four mats personally.
2 ships or 3 players = 1 mat
4-6 ships or 2-4 players = 2 mats
6-10 ships of 5-8 players = 4 mats

So it looks like 2 mats is a minimum? Can 4 ships run on one mat without a lot of issue?

Thanks :g&t:

[The Royal Hajj]

Do you tend to play Wings on a surfce as wide as 4'?

Unless I'm playing the kid at home, I play on either 4x6, 5x8, or four mats in a square configuration.


So it looks like 2 mats is a minimum? Can 4 ships run on one mat without a lot of issue?

Four ships could be ran on a single mat of 27"x39". Keep in mind though that the combat rulers are 10" long. That means a ship in the center of the 27" side is going to be able to shoot anything that is 3.5" or more "in to" the table. That does not leave a lot of sea room to maneuver. So, playing on a single mat is going to make for an action packed game. Not a bad thing, just something to be aware of. And if you happen to be to be on the lee side of a ship, that 3.5" is going to seem awfully small!

[Cmmdre]

:hatsoff:
Unless I'm playing the kid at home, I play on either 4x6, 5x8, or four mats in a square configuration.



Four ships could be ran on a single mat of 27"x39". Keep in mind though that the combat rulers are 10" long. That means a ship in the center of the 27" side is going to be able to shoot anything that is 3.5" or more "in to" the table. That does not leave a lot of sea room to maneuver. So, playing on a single mat is going to make for an action packed game. Not a bad thing, just something to be aware of. And if you happen to be to be on the lee side of a ship, that 3.5" is going to seem awfully small!

:hatsoff: Thank you for the great beta. Can't wait to start playing.:happy:

[Green flash]

Getting excited:shootright:

[Andy Blozinski]

I was wondering if I could pull it off running three mats. If you line them all up on the 39" sides, that's a 3*27" = 81"x 39" playing surface. I'd prefer that 39" was a bit more, but 81" seems like a lot.

[The Barrelman]

I am going to start investigating alternative mat types in larger square configurations. I don't think I would enjoy playing with multiple mats joined together. To much shifting around and cost of multiples. Or just run on a plain surface. Would not be the best pictures for AAR posts.

Thanks

:salute:

[Coog]

It shouldn't be too difficult finding something that is colored so that it can be used as ocean. The only thing that could be a problem is that it won't have the light grid pattern to help with determining wind direction when using the attitude indicator.

[Cmmdre]

That's easy. Go to your local fabric store, JoAnn's comes to mind, and buy a couple of bolts. Measure out what you'll need. Get a gold or silver marker to pattern your grid and you've got a matt ready to play.

[The Barrelman]

Found this company that offers a sea blue felt map with grids in various shapes and sizes. It looks like a full size would be good and a double size for really big battles.

Looks like 4 inch hexes would be good for the SoG scale from the description of the mat.

Sea Game Mats (http://www.hotzmats.com/mat_1-sea-blue.html)

[The Barrelman]

If anyone plays WGF or WGS would probably like these mats. I am going to get a regular size for my WGF games.

European Fields (http://www.hotzmats.com/mat_1-euro_field.html)
Enhanced European Fields (http://www.hotzmats.com/mat_1-en_euro.html)

[Cmmdre]

:hatsoff: Great information Ted. Hats off to you sir. :hatsoff:

[The Barrelman]

:hatsoff: Great information Ted. Hats off to you sir. :hatsoff:

Thank you!! Glad I could finally provide some useful information.

It looks like a full size mat (72 x 45 inch) would provide a little more play area then three standard mats (81 x 39 inch) joined on the long edge for around the same price (retail).

[The Royal Hajj]

Quite a few people use the Hotz mats. Just be warned, that if you need to roll or fold up your mats between games... these have a tendency to crease and not lay as flat. I've ran several convention games on the new Wings mats, 4 of them in a large square shape. There were no issues at all with the mats shifting or moving around. The rubber backing does an excellent job at holding them in place.

The other great thing about these mats, they lay perfectly flat every time you unroll them.

[7eat51]

Picked up two WoG mats today. Placed them together on the dining room table. They look and feel great. The rubber backing definitely keeps them in place and they do lay perfectly flat. I am impressed with their quality. Not a bad looking table cloth if you ask me.

[Cmmdre]

:happy: Glad to hear that.

[Sea Gull]

Picked up two WoG mats today. Placed them together on the dining room table. They look and feel great. The rubber backing definitely keeps them in place and they do lay perfectly flat. I am impressed with their quality. Not a bad looking table cloth if you ask me.

And did you ask your better half? :happy: I know your good lady enjoys the games and taking photos. But does she enjoy it enough to have the mats as a table cloth? :question::hmmm:

[David Manley]

Not a bad looking table cloth if you ask me.

Great idea - cuts down the time between game time and dinner time, and vice versa. Come to think of it, you could combine the two for extra temporal efficiency :)

[Devsdoc]

Great idea - cuts down the time between game time and dinner time, and vice versa. Come to think of it, you could combine the two for extra temporal efficiency :)


Would make for a good in shore battle. Battle around the dinner sevice. Don't move the gravy boat:erk:
Be safe
Rory

[Andy Blozinski]

To be honest, I'm now thinking on skipping the mat at this time. It looks like it's going to be either $60 or $80 for enough mat to run a convention game. If it looks like the game is quite easy and fast and everyone would have more fun running two ships, I'm going to need to get more ships..now. I already have a felt blue mat with a hex grid printed on it I can use. I'm thinking I need to drop the mats and spend the money on extra ships instead.

[Cmmdre]

Would make for a good in shore battle. Battle around the dinner sevice. Don't move the gravy boat:erk:
Be safe
Rory
If the gravy boat goes down all hands to the biscuits. :surrender:

[csadn]

Get a dinner table with a separate glass top; slide the map under the glass. :)

"Look out for that reef!"
"That's a gravy stain, you nob."

[Capt P]

Another felt mat is HOTZ MATS. I have a sea mat of theirs with 5" hexes. They cost some but I thing worth the price. I use their European Fields mat for my WWI Wings games

[Beowulf03809]

I'm just not yet sure about any grid on them. I hope we have a chance to see them before purchase commitment.

[7eat51]

And did you ask your better half? :happy: I know your good lady enjoys the games and taking photos. But does she enjoy it enough to have the mats as a table cloth? :question::hmmm:


Great idea - cuts down the time between game time and dinner time, and vice versa. Come to think of it, you could combine the two for extra temporal efficiency :)

Funny thing is, Sue is working on mat designs. She has contacted printing companies and material supply companies, has been looking at images, etc. I should discuss dual purpose gaming mats with her - dining cloths, bed spreads, afghans, carpets.

When I am in trouble, she could use a no-man's land bedspread as a sign that I am sleeping on the couch.

[The Royal Hajj]

To be honest, I'm now thinking on skipping the mat at this time. It looks like it's going to be either $60 or $80 for enough mat to run a convention game. If it looks like the game is quite easy and fast and everyone would have more fun running two ships, I'm going to need to get more ships..now. I already have a felt blue mat with a hex grid printed on it I can use. I'm thinking I need to drop the mats and spend the money on extra ships instead.

I've now played a game where each player was sailing a single ship and one where each was sailing two ships. One ship per person is much better. It's easy to run two ships, but you lose the attachment you have to your ship when doing that. It also allows for near perfect coordination between two ships. I'll keep all of my Con events to a single ship per player.

[Andy Blozinski]

I've now played a game where each player was sailing a single ship and one where each was sailing two ships. One ship per person is much better. It's easy to run two ships, but you lose the attachment you have to your ship when doing that. It also allows for near perfect coordination between two ships. I'll keep all of my Con events to a single ship per player.
Please let me know a few details here.
How many players did you have at the same time in the game you played with the largest numbers of players? How long did it take to play a single game?

[David Manley]

I've now played a game where each player was sailing a single ship and one where each was sailing two ships. One ship per person is much better.

That was pretty much my findings as well. I have played up to three ships per person, but at that stage the informaton overload and sense of detachment was pretty severe. One per person felt "right".

Kind of mirrors my experiences with Mark Campbell's "Close Action" where I've played some thrilling fleet action games with one person controlling one ship (which did mean games with over 50 players!). Victory goes to those Admirals who establish a simple command and control strategy (we used signalling rules as the only way to communicate between ships unless those ships were running side by side - which for various reasons ISN'T advisable normally), who devise and maintain a simple plan on which they brief their captains prior to battle, and captains who remain focussed on that plan and who do as they are ordered. It was noticeable that, on at least one occasion, a fleet fell apart because some of the players decided they knew better and manoeuvred accordingly - not good!

I would expect that success in a SOG fleet level game would see the same characteristics if done properly. I'm already working on adapting my signalling system from FLoB to SOG. Alas getting 50 players together could be a challenge (in the UK at least) but I'll be keeping my eye open for reports of monster games from some of the big conventions in the US, where they already run big CA games :)

[7eat51]

That was pretty much my findings as well. I have played up to three ships per person, but at that stage the informaton overload and sense of detachment was pretty severe. One per person felt "right".

Kind of mirrors my experiences with Mark Campbell's "Close Action" where I've played some thrilling fleet action games with one person controlling one ship (which did mean games with over 50 players!). Victory goes to those Admirals who establish a simple command and control strategy (we used signalling rules as the only way to communicate between ships unless those ships were running side by side - which for various reasons ISN'T advisable normally), who devise and maintain a simple plan on which they brief their captains prior to battle, and captains who remain focussed on that plan and who do as they are ordered. It was noticeable that, on at least one occasion, a fleet fell apart because some of the players decided they knew better and manoeuvred accordingly - not good!

I would expect that success in a SOG fleet level game would see the same characteristics if done properly. I'm already working on adapting my signalling system from FLoB to SOG. Alas getting 50 players together could be a challenge (in the UK at least) but I'll be keeping my eye open for reports of monster games from some of the big conventions in the US, where they already run big CA games :)

Interesting issue with the connection between one player and his/her ship. I had a similar experience last week in WGF. I started by controlling a few planes, but after an opposing player was shot down and helped me run my side, the emotional investment in the one plane I then flew grew. I had not thought about that with SoG before. This could encourage even more small-scale battles when playing at home.

I look forward to seeing your signaling system translation to SoG.

[Berthier]

If you want "real fog of war" do the battle on line with 50 players and an umpire for each fleet...that would be a whole new experience although impossible to organise.

[Beowulf03809]

I REALLY like the idea of players controlling individual ships (or maybe two if they are unrated of Fifth Rate in a larger engagement) but my biggest concern is one of inappropriate coordination. Though this is 'just a game' the chain of command (or freedom from!) was often a major factor in the success of fleet actions. In many friendly games at the LGS this isn't a big deal (though it would be a fun factor) but when using SoG either at a tournament or else in educational settings having individual ships require signal flags would be great (and possibly account for smoke if you really want to be evil). I'm going to spin up a separate thread to discuss that so we don't derail this one.

Sticking to topic...anyone see the mats yet? Pics would be VERY appreciated before ordering. I'd almost rather put funds to more ships than an unknown mat style but if it's really nice it might win out.

[daledavis67]

I think Ares would be making a serious economic error if they make these mats incompatible with the WoG mats. They would be cutting out a large portion of potential sales.

I am sure I speak for more than a few WoG players when I say, even if I weren't buying into SoG, I would buy multiple mats just to expand my options for WoG.

[The Royal Hajj]

It all depends on your requirements for being compatible. They will be the same size and made out of the same materiel as the Wings mats. The artwork (to whatever extent they chose to do) is going to be geared towards Sails. So, they are going to physically be compatible with the Wings mats, but the look might be quite different. While I agree that dual purpose mats would be great, I would not want to sacrifice functionality or looks in regards to the game that each mat is supposed to support.

[daledavis67]

If they do grids on the open sea mats maybe they should make them as light as possible. From all of the discussion it seems like all of the terrain is going to be overlays anyway. If you had a wind indicator off the map you could use a laser pointer or level to set the AI facing.

Multi-purpose mats are not just great, they are a smart financial decision for the company. Like making reversed copies of shoreline mats to give more options like harbors.

[7eat51]

If they do grids on the open sea mats maybe they should make them as light as possible. From all of the discussion it seems like all of the terrain is going to be overlays anyway. If you had a wind indicator off the map you could use a laser pointer or level to set the AI facing.

Multi-purpose mats are not just great, they are a smart financial decision for the company. Like making reversed copies of shoreline mats to give more options like harbors.

Laser pointer?

We have had conversations about the tradeoffs between realism/accuracy and playability. As much as I would like to see mats without grids for aesthetic reasons as well as the desire to place open sea mats next to WoG coastal mats, I have come to agree with Keith about their usefulness in playing the game, especially since he has played it and I have not. Once things become too technical or too detailed, the spirit of SoG will take a hit, and that is not a price I find worthy to pay.

[daledavis67]

If the point of the game is to have fun anyway I don't think a slight adjustment to the AI would matter that much. I was suggesting the laser pointer for those really competitive folks who need everything exact. I guess we just wait and see how they handle it when we are not watching "prototype" game play mechanics and props.

I can't wait to see the real parts.

[7eat51]

I don't think any given game can be all things to all people. I wouldn't worry about those highly competitive folks, because they probably will find fault someplace else within the system. If some want to use laser pointer because they enjoy such fine detail, they can use them. To make decisions about the game with such folks in mind would require significant changes in game design throughout, for example not every cannon has the same firing range. The grid, as I understand it, facilitates game play by making it easier for folks to know the general orientation of the wind. This way, players spend more time thinking about moves than managing mechanics.

[daledavis67]

You will probably run into the same issues as in wings of glory where people don't line things exactly bump other mink
is. You can usually see if someone is doing it intentionally or repeatedly. Not the kind of people I want to game with.

[The Royal Hajj]

If they do grids on the open sea mats maybe they should make them as light as possible. From all of the discussion it seems like all of the terrain is going to be overlays anyway. If you had a wind indicator off the map you could use a laser pointer or level to set the AI facing.

Multi-purpose mats are not just great, they are a smart financial decision for the company. Like making reversed copies of shoreline mats to give more options like harbors.


Ares has stated from the beginning that it will be a “light grid”. I can only trust in them to strike a good balance between game play and game visuals. I can’t fault them on anything they have done in Wings (Well, they could have made the maneuver arrows show up a little better on the maneuver cards).

As for dual mats being smart financial decisions, that all depends on the total number of sales. If 70% of Sails players would have bought the Sails mats, but only 50% did because they had lost some function to fit in with another game and, that other game only generated about 15% in additional sales, the company would have lost out by making them dual purpose.

As a company, Ares has to look at several factors when deciding if it is worth making these mats dual purpose. The first is, does it detract from the game it is being designed for? Do, they even make a product to use an all sea mat in Wings (no, not at this time)? How many all sea mats would they even sell to Wings players? Finally, would they sell more if they made a separate mat for each game (how many Wings players want a Sails logo on their mat and vice versa?)?

I can tell you from sales data from my store that in regards to the number they would sell to Wings players would be very small. I sell about 10-12 Country mats for each Coastal mat I sale. I would imagine that would drop to around 25-30 to 1 for an all sea mat. So, assuming they produce 5000 Country mats per print run (and I think it’s actually much lower then that), they would need to print only about 160 all sea mats. Would you be willing to pay $5-$10 more for an all sea mat then a Country mat? Because in order for them to make them and me to stock them as a store, we’d need better margins on them to make up for the amount of time we would have to sit on them to recuperate our outlay. And if we charged more for them, we’d sell less… just making the problem worse.

Out of curiosity, how many Costal mats for Wings do you have?


I guess we just wait and see how they handle it when we are not watching "prototype" game play mechanics and props.

I can't wait to see the real parts.

I’ve got and played with several of the “real” parts and my thoughts and posts are based on those.

[Devsdoc]

Does all this mater and what scale is the sea mat in:question:
Be safe
Rory:drinks:

[daledavis67]

Since I have only been collecting since last month I only have one of each of the currently released WoG items. So I only have 1 Coastal Map. I am going to buy several more so I can do some coastal scenarios for War at Sea.

[Cmmdre]

Since I have only been collecting since last month I only have one of each of the currently released WoG items. So I only have 1 Coastal Map. I am going to buy several more so I can do some coastal scenarios for War at Sea.

Only started collecting WoG a month ago and straight away into SGN. Dale, Dale, Dale, I too suffer from addiction to collecting little plastic ships but it sounds like you have it worse. :moneygone: :minis: