On This Day 22 July

[Coog]

The Battle of Santa Cruz de Tenerife was an amphibious assault by the Royal Navy on the Spanish port city of Santa Cruz de Tenerife in the Canary Islands. Launched by Rear-Admiral Horatio Nelson on 22 July 1797, the assault was defeated, and on 25 July the remains of the landing party withdrew under a truce with the loss of several hundred casualties. Nelson himself had been wounded in the arm, which was subsequently partially amputated: a stigma that he carried to his grave as a constant reminder of his failure.

[Coog]

In the Battle of Cape Finisterre, 22 July 1805, off Galicia, Spain, the British fleet under Admiral Robert Calder fought an indecisive naval battle against the Combined Franco-Spanish fleet which was returning from the West Indies. Calder failed to prevent the joining of Villeneuve's fleet to the squadron of Ferrol and to strike the shattering blow that would have freed Great Britain from the danger of an invasion, Calder was later court-martialled and severely reprimanded for his failure and for avoiding the renewal of the engagement on 23 and 24 July.

"If Admiral Villeneuve, instead of entering Ferrol, had contented himself with rallying at the Spanish squadron, and had sailed for Brest to join Admiral Gantheaume, my army would have landed; it would have been all over with England."

—General Napoleon Bonaparte, 8th Sept, 1815.

[Anav]

1802 - Frigate Constellation defeats 9 Corsair gunboats off Tripoli.
1905 - Body of John Paul Jones moved to Annapolis, MD for reburial.

[Comte de Brueys]

A shame that de Brueys died in Abukir...

He was the Admiral the French needed for the combined fleet.

Villeneuve was second choice.:p

[csadn]

A shame that de Brueys died in Abukir...

He was the Admiral the French needed for the combined fleet.

Bah -- given his performance at Aboukir, he doesn't strike me as much better than Villeneuve. I'd go with promoting Lucas; get some newer blood in the staff ranks.

[Comte de Brueys]

Nobody could imagine, that the evil Brits could sail the landwards waters at Abukir.:p




This newer blood thing was a real disatvantage for the French Navy. They had to assing former aristocrats for commanding positions.

In the first revolutionary years the french fleet din't play a role in the battles versus Austria, Prussia, etc. So there were not the same conditions for those young (elected) commanders.

They haven't had those problems with the army commanders.

[csadn]

Nobody could imagine, that the evil Brits could sail the landwards waters at Abukir.

Eh -- most reports I read have Breuys botching his deployment by not having his ships anchored at both ends; when the wind shifted to blow into the harbor, it also rotated the French ships to allow a clear path for the British to double-envelop the French van -- and that same wind also precluded the French rear from sailing up to aid the van, so while the numbers of ships were equal, the British were able to defeat in detail the French.



This newer blood thing was a real disatvantage for the French Navy. They had to assing former aristocrats for commanding positions.

And the ones who were left were the ones best able to save their own skins -- *not* the ones who knew how to fight, or were willing to put themselves in harm's way. Younger men may have lacked experience, but they could have acquired it.


In the first revolutionary years the french fleet din't play a role in the battles versus Austria, Prussia, etc. So there were not the same conditions for those young (elected) commanders.

They haven't had those problems with the army commanders.

See above. If Napoleon had been a man of the sea, who knows what he might have accomplished?

[Comte de Brueys]

Eh -- most reports I read have Breuys botching his deployment by not having his ships anchored at both ends; when the wind shifted to blow into the harbor, it also rotated the French ships to allow a clear path for the British to double-envelop the French van -- and that same wind also precluded the French rear from sailing up to aid the van, so while the numbers of ships were equal, the British were able to defeat in detail the French.

Another detail, but not the main reason in my eyes.

...and one I heard the first time.:confused:

Other details: The french ships had not their 100 % crews, less training, many men were at land when the attack begun, the landwards gunports of many ships were blocked wits goods etc... A very long list.


If Napoleon had been a man of the sea, who knows what he might have accomplished?

That's right, but many of his army commanders had already a career before Napoleon becomes a consul at the end of 1799.

[David Manley]

"Another detail, but not the main reason in my eyes."

indeed, I've studied the battle for many years and have never come across this cited as a reason for the French defeat.