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csadn
03-05-2012, 19:45
In reading about the US Navy of the Revolutionary War period, I keep seeing reference to "the US Navy's one ship-of-the-line"; being a _Monty Python_ fan, I immediately think of this exchange:

British Person: What's that, then, Yank?
American Person: That's our US Navy's ship-of-the-line.
B: No, it isn't.
A: What?
B: It isn't a ship-of-the-line.
A: Yes, it is -- it has the correct number of guns; how can it not be a ship-of-the-line?
B: Well, there's only one of them, isn't there?
A: ...yes.
B: Well, you can't have a "line" of One Ship. You need at least two ships-of-the-line to have a Line Of Ships. What you have there, if anything, is a Ship-Of-The-Point.
A: Look here, my good man -- it has more than 64 guns; it qualifies as a Ship-Of-The-Line.
B: No, it doesn't -- you need two of them to make a Line; you only have one. It don't work.
Narrator: And thus the War of 1812 began.
[Terry Gilliam animation of ships and troops having extremely surreal battle]

David Manley
03-05-2012, 23:21
The US Army had that recruiting slogan "an army of one". Perhaps the navy could have "a line of one"? :)

Berthier
03-06-2012, 03:18
Chris
Love it!

csadn
03-06-2012, 18:34
The US Army had that recruiting slogan "an army of one". Perhaps the navy could have "a line of one"? :)

"Look 'ere, mate -- in order to have a Line, one must have a minimum of *two* points to define it! A single point is just that -- a Point."
"But it's still legally a ship-of-the-line."
[Etc.]

:)

David Manley
03-07-2012, 00:15
One point on the bow, one on the stern :)

Churruca
03-07-2012, 01:43
Maybe... a ship-of-the-unexisting-line??
Great sketch, really!! :D

Berthier
03-07-2012, 03:34
I think you are missing the point.

csadn
03-07-2012, 18:58
One point on the bow, one on the stern :)

No, no -- look at a drawing of a battle -- each ship is a point. Two ships -- one line between them. Having a single ship precludes having a Line Of Ships.

(This could go on for *weeks*.... >;) )

David Manley
03-07-2012, 23:48
Ah, but here's a thing. In 1905 the Japanese were putting armoured cruisers in their line of battle, so there's nothing to stop the USN appointing a suitable proxy ship in the absence of a second liner. Or go get some allies and line up with them. Worked for the French and Spanish (kind of) :)

csadn
03-09-2012, 15:05
Ah, but here's a thing. In 1905 the Japanese were putting armoured cruisers in their line of battle, so there's nothing to stop the USN appointing a suitable proxy ship in the absence of a second liner. Or go get some allies and line up with them. Worked for the French and Spanish (kind of) :)

This is true -- and the lower limit of a SoL changed over time; some early SoLs had as few as 50 guns.

Doubt the "allies" thing would work -- the only people with an effective navy were the same people the US fought to get away from.... :)

Blackrose
03-10-2012, 05:10
This is true -- and the lower limit of a SoL changed over time; some early SoLs had as few as 50 guns.

Doubt the "allies" thing would work -- the only people with an effective navy were the same people the US fought to get away from.... :)

There would be a good MP skit: the Franco-American line ;)
I'm having visions of canned pasta now (hmmm..must be really hungery, as I detest canned pasta). That would go with the SPAM!
Karl

csadn
03-10-2012, 21:20
There would be a good MP skit: the Franco-American line

One of my alternate-history scenarios has the French royalty escaping on (and with) the French Royal Navy, and retaking Louisiana from the Spanish; then having to sell out to the Americans (the French royalty being not exactly well-known for their Work Ethic...), thus providing the US with a ready-made fleet for when the inevitable shootout with Britain occurs. As a sop to their egos (and out of necessity), some ships remain effectively French, while others are American. So one ends up with British ships fighting a combined French-American fleet of a sort.

David Manley
03-10-2012, 23:56
"canned pasta"

Fortunately a development that does not seem to have made it here from the colonies :D
(apart from spaghetti hoops in tommy sauce which, as any child will tell you, is lovely!!)

Blackrose
03-11-2012, 04:44
One of my alternate-history scenarios has the French royalty escaping on (and with) the French Royal Navy, and retaking Louisiana from the Spanish; then having to sell out to the Americans (the French royalty being not exactly well-known for their Work Ethic...), thus providing the US with a ready-made fleet for when the inevitable shootout with Britain occurs. As a sop to their egos (and out of necessity), some ships remain effectively French, while others are American. So one ends up with British ships fighting a combined French-American fleet of a sort.

Now that's just full of possibilities. Not that the thought of French Royal presence in the New World wouldn't have made many American Nationalists cringe.
Karl

Blackrose
03-11-2012, 04:45
"canned pasta"

Fortunately a development that does not seem to have made it here from the colonies :D
(apart from spaghetti hoops in tommy sauce which, as any child will tell you, is lovely!!)

Be very VERY grateful for that.
Karl

csadn
03-11-2012, 23:50
Now that's just full of possibilities. Not that the thought of French Royal presence in the New World wouldn't have made many American Nationalists cringe.

Let's just say: The French Royals learn the Way Of The (New) World *VERY* quickly (the Dauphin ends up serving in the US Navy, and learns *why* the French Nobility got booted out; the story of his reign after Napoleon goes to Hel[ena] is... entertaining. >:) )

Blackrose
03-12-2012, 15:56
Let's just say: The French Royals learn the Way Of The (New) World *VERY* quickly (the Dauphin ends up serving in the US Navy, and learns *why* the French Nobility got booted out; the story of his reign after Napoleon goes to Hel[ena] is... entertaining. >:) )

Hmmm...are you writing stories now? Can we get them to read?
Karl

csadn
03-12-2012, 16:17
Hmmm...are you writing stories now? Can we get them to read?


Not yet -- my 4WPM typing speed means it takes a *long* time to get a story down; plus the obligatory intrusions of Reality (I'm home all day, so I get to make the supply runs). I really need to find a keyboard which accommodates my fingers; most keyboards, if I'm not dead-center on the key, I hit two keys at once, and my typing looks like Azathoth is possessing my computer. :)

Mark Barker
03-17-2012, 15:58
It is a well known fact in archaeology that you need three bricks to claim a wall.

Just having two ships together could be an accident - with three you can claim a line !

(Actually when we fight a fleet action any player that has three ships in a line after the first hour generally gets a round of applause and admiring glances. Too much of that sort of thing is however considered bad form and just showing off !)

Mark Barker
The Inshore Squadron

Bligh
03-22-2012, 11:22
The actual clue is in the shortest word, "of". You can be of something without having to be in it. For example a Member of Parliament. Although to be fair they are more often in it than not these days.
As we all know the British did have a line of battle, but a Ship of the Line when on detatched service was still referred to as "of the line". Therefore, the fact that the USN. consisted of only one vessel made no difference to its status as a Ship of the Line. Had the USN. possessed more ships of the line, by being in the line the ship would still have been of the line, even though there was no line from which it could become detatched.
I will now explain the rules of Cricket for anyone who is still interested.
Bligh.