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Bruno.hofke
07-05-2014, 12:20
The fact of the sloop is a much more maneuverable ship and have a low profile, do not make it harder to hit? What do you think of pulling one less damage counter against a sloop? With a minimum of one damage counter.

Jack Aubrey
07-05-2014, 12:22
Well that`s an idea...did you test it? :question:

bakblast
07-06-2014, 22:31
The number of chits drawn represents the volume of fire not the chance to hit, the 0's represent that portion of fire that misses.

The sloop IS faster and more maneuverable, that is represented by the length of the move lines and the tightness of the turns.

Just because a sloop is faster and lower, does not reduce the number of cannon that will fire at it.

Use that maneuverability play about the stern and avoid any broadsides from frigates or larger.

Gunner
07-06-2014, 23:28
John has the right idea. If not, does that mean if a sloop is firing at a sloop it's largest broadside is a 1-1-1? A one on one fight could last forever. (unless one is French):surrender:

Bruno.hofke
07-07-2014, 08:57
Well that`s an idea...did you test it? :question:

I have not yet had the chance to test I only have a French and an English Sloop, and placing against each other this rule does not make much sense. This rule would make more sense in a confrontation between several Sloops against a frigate or an SOL.:question:

Bruno.hofke
07-07-2014, 09:01
The number of chits drawn represents the volume of fire not the chance to hit, the 0's represent that portion of fire that misses.

The sloop IS faster and more maneuverable, that is represented by the length of the move lines and the tightness of the turns.

Just because a sloop is faster and lower, does not reduce the number of cannon that will fire at it.

Use that maneuverability play about the stern and avoid any broadsides from frigates or larger.

I understand that this is the game mechanics, but this mechanic only takes into account the distance, represented by the damage A or B, and the amount of guns represented by the number of chits drawn. It ignores the target size or speed. When you shoot at a stationary first-rate three-decker ship, or a Sloop at full speed your chance to hit are the same.:takecover:

Bruno.hofke
07-07-2014, 09:13
John has the right idea. If not, does that mean if a sloop is firing at a sloop it's largest broadside is a 1-1-1? A one on one fight could last forever. (unless one is French):surrender:

I mean you always draws at least one chit, really does not make sense to use this rule in a clash between two Sloops. This rule would make more sense in a confrontation between several Sloops against a frigate or an SOL.

I'm sorry for my “Google trasleitor” English.:embarass:

Gunner
07-07-2014, 12:48
I mean you always draws at least one chit, really does not make sense to use this rule in a clash between two Sloops. This rule would make more sense in a confrontation between several Sloops against a frigate or an SOL.

I'm sorry for my “Google trasleitor” English.:embarass:


Your use of Google is better than my English.:thumbsup:

bakblast
07-07-2014, 21:20
I understand that this is the game mechanics, but this mechanic only takes into account the distance, represented by the damage A or B, and the amount of guns represented by the number of chits drawn. It ignores the target size or speed. When you shoot at a stationary first-rate three-decker ship, or a Sloop at full speed your chance to hit are the same.:takecover:

The game is about maneuver, that is why we play this game, they give us a more nimble ship that is the defense. Keep it out of harms way.

There is no need to abstract the nimbleness of a sloop, since the mechanic addresses it directly.

A sloop should never be anywhere other than out of range or raking the stern of anything 5th rate or larger..

David Manley
07-07-2014, 23:55
A sloop should never be anywhere other than out of range or raking the stern of anything 5th rate or larger..

Woe betide you if you do end up there, lest your enemies rechristen your ship the "Prince Oberyn" :happy:

DeRuyter
07-08-2014, 14:08
Woe betide you if you do end up there, lest your enemies rechristen your ship the "Prince Oberyn" :happy:

You just knew something bad was going to happen, I had a hard time getting that image out of my head. :erk::bleh:

bakblast
07-08-2014, 20:24
Woe betide you if you do end up there, lest your enemies rechristen your ship the "Prince Oberyn" :happy:

Please tell me there is a nautical reference here, and not just Game of Thrones.

DeRuyter
07-15-2014, 12:24
Please tell me there is a nautical reference here, and not just Game of Thrones.

Yes essentially the smaller but more nimble ship (sloop) best stay out of range or arc of the broadside of the larger ship or risk a pounding with one shot. So you have the analogy to the combat scene in GoT, etc.

Diamondback
07-15-2014, 17:38
I might propose a house-rule that sloops ignore 1's, but take the full drawn damage on 2 or greater or any Special Damage.

Not totally sure about the premise myself, but I just thought I'd throw the idea out for discussion and possible testing.

CSherrange
07-15-2014, 17:52
It is represented by the burden already. A higher damage 'B' chit is devestating to a 3rd rate or frigate. It is just another damage box to the sloop. Same as a 1 damage.

Diamondback
07-15-2014, 17:57
Charles, part of my thinking was given the amount of zeros and ones in the pile, the trade-off of lower probability of hit vs. One Hit Wonder if you are.

Seriously, if all I got is a sloop and I gotta take out an SOL, I'm not gonna waste time firing, I'm gonna try to rig some powder from the magazine into charges, tie up to the stern and try to plant boomstuff somewhere crippling.

Or if I'm sailing a total heap of crap, rig it as a floating bomb, tie up astern, take to the boats and Row Like Hell. The Admiralty Beancounters may not like it, but they sure don't seem to be too concerned about the loss of brigs by the job-lot, so trading a sloop for an SOL should be considered COMMENDABLE, especially if you manage to get most of your crew back from it safely.

CSherrange
07-15-2014, 17:59
If I'm in a sloop vs. anything but another sloop I'm running with the wind under full sheet as fast as possible, no looking back. Sloops are for juicy merchants and delivering mail.. :takecover:

Diamondback
07-15-2014, 18:03
Yes, but the Sissy Gold Braid Set expect everyone else to chuck their self-preservative instincts out the window and die "for the greater good" whenever some SGB'er gets a WHUTA. Orders may be murder, but they ARE orders... and they aren't necessarily known for always having reason. logic or sound judgment attached either.

Naharaht
07-15-2014, 18:24
Wouldn't the cannon balls do proportionately more damage to a more lightly constructed ship? So, leave the rule as it is.

7eat51
07-16-2014, 06:43
if all I got is a sloop and I gotta take out an SOL

Not only would I run, like Charles stated, but would such a larger ship fire upon a sloop without the sloop firing first?

David Manley
07-16-2014, 06:53
Yes, but the Sissy Gold Braid Set expect everyone else to chuck their self-preservative instincts out the window and die "for the greater good" whenever some SGB'er gets a WHUTA. Orders may be murder, but they ARE orders... and they aren't necessarily known for always having reason. logic or sound judgment attached either.

maybe a popular view of high command, but in general the admiralties of the navies that we seek to recreate here were rather more rational than that. The likelihood of a sloop's captain being reprimanded because they didn't take on a SoL (or even a frigate) would be the square root of naff all, and in fact it would be highly likely that (if they survived the encounter) they'd be court martialled or drummed out of the service for being a total idiot (and needlessly imperilling his ship and crew). OK, one or two navies did go in for congratulating their COs for being wazzocks but generally the reverse was the norm.

Would a larger ship fire on a smaller one? Probably. The "SoLs don't shoot first at frigates" thing was, to quote a vaguely relevant movie, "more a set 'o guidelines" - and a SOL would most definitely fire on a smaller ship if it was construed in some way to be a threat to the ship or the mission, or was believed to be engaged in a valuable duty, such as carrying dispatches.

7eat51
07-16-2014, 07:00
Would the first firing be across the bow, if you will?

Is there a difference between coming across a lone smaller vessel and a fleet action in which all types of vessels are present?

bakblast
07-16-2014, 22:21
A sloop would not get within ten cable lenghts of anything larger than a frigate if it could help it, and that's too close for fear of an unfavorable wind shift.