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Andy Blozinski
10-27-2013, 15:40
For those of you that have already run convention games, what problems have you noticed that you feel would require more attention. I've been worried about myself and the players keeping in line with the Veer rules for card choice, for instance. Basically I just need to know what things, from your experience, you feel maybe I should emphasize in briefings and give extra attention to during the game to avoid the issues you've observed.

The Royal Hajj
10-28-2013, 10:11
Wind attitude, veer and when canons are actually reloaded are the top three for me.

David Manley
10-28-2013, 13:14
Smoke markers help you to keep track of reloading. I've rarely had players lose track when using them in "Form Line of Battle" and similarly in the SGN demo/parti games I've run using them. Having the turn sequence writ large on a display board helps too.

Naharaht
10-28-2013, 19:58
Have you lost many items through participants taking 'souvenirs'?

7eat51
10-28-2013, 20:08
Have you lost many items through participants taking 'souvenirs'?

I ran two games at different cons this weekend. Not only do I believe that nothing was taken, but the caliber of folks playing and the spirit around the table was such that, until I read your question, the thought of anyone taking anything never entered my mind.

Coog
10-28-2013, 20:40
Have you lost many items through participants taking 'souvenirs'?

I've played or run a lot of different games and don't know of anyone having a problem with stealing. However, there is always the chance of accidents and damaged items or items just coming apart. It's always good to keep the appropriate glue(s) with you for emergencies.

7eat51
10-28-2013, 21:20
I've played or run a lot of different games and don't know of anyone having a problem with stealing.

It seems, too, that WoG, and I dare say, SoG, players are a friendly breed. There were a few pirates (BBSuds and crashx) that showed up for the Rock-Con game, but they behaved well. Maybe I should have checked their pockets after all. Hmmm.

Andy Blozinski
10-29-2013, 22:12
Smoke markers help you to keep track of reloading. I've rarely had players lose track when using them in "Form Line of Battle" and similarly in the SGN demo/parti games I've run using them. Having the turn sequence writ large on a display board helps too.
I didn't load up on the smoke markers because I just wasn't sure what the situation was with them. Now I wish I had.
It looks like the first convention to use my Kickstarter stuff will be OwlCon in February, so I'll have plenty of time to order a few extra things. I'll probably run at least once at the game store before then.

DeRuyter
11-01-2013, 12:47
I didn't load up on the smoke markers because I just wasn't sure what the situation was with them. Now I wish I had.
It looks like the first convention to use my Kickstarter stuff will be OwlCon in February, so I'll have plenty of time to order a few extra things. I'll probably run at least once at the game store before then.

In the past I have used lengths of cotton from pillow stuffing that you can pick up in craft stores (it is actually synthetic I believe). Just rip off a strip the size of a broadside and you are good to go, and you can lightly spray them grey for effect.

CHolgren
11-01-2013, 13:06
In the past I have used lengths of cotton from pillow stuffing that you can pick up in craft stores (it is actually synthetic I believe). Just rip off a strip the size of a broadside and you are good to go, and you can lightly spray them grey for effect.

You could always use a length of yarn for indicators. Tease it out for a fuller look or just buy thick yarn. Not sure about the aesthetic, but fast and easy to make

Andy Blozinski
11-01-2013, 18:34
In the past I have used lengths of cotton from pillow stuffing that you can pick up in craft stores (it is actually synthetic I believe). Just rip off a strip the size of a broadside and you are good to go, and you can lightly spray them grey for effect.
The advantages to the markers that Keith is supplying is that they can have different colors on either side, they are compact and they will stay in place well. I have a heap of cotton batting I could make smoke markers with or I could even get a buddy to make 3-D plastic smoke markers with a 3-D printer. I'm just seeing these 2-D markers as much more useful aids for the players to keep track of gun loading and firing during conventions. I WILL buy more of them.

7eat51
11-02-2013, 09:00
For the upcoming con, you could make some smoke markers out of construction paper, with different colors on both sides. In the kit, you should have enough markers for the number of ships you have, especially, since most of the time, not every ship is firing on a given turn.

We used the zero counters that people received to mark off crew hits when necessary. Since each crew hit box only takes one chit to mark it off, the actual chit used was irrelevant; you'll see this when drawing a damage counter that has both hull and crew damage/hits.

David Manley
11-02-2013, 09:12
Intrigued, why do you need to have to mark each side's smoke? The markers sit on the base and move with the ship.

7eat51
11-02-2013, 09:38
We used the white side to mark that a ship fired in a given round, and then flipped it to the brown side at the end of the round. During the following turn, it was clear which ships were reloading and unable to fire because they had the brown smoke markers attached to them. We found this easier and more memorable than having to keep track of ammo on the ship mats. Again, this was with a demo kit and an incomplete set of gaming equipment. I think we will continue to use the smoke markers this way when the game is actually received, because when looking at the playing surface to see how to plan moves, firing information is readily available. We will use the ship mats to record what type of ammo is loaded, as many of us have entered the age of forgetfulness.

Andy Blozinski
11-02-2013, 09:43
Intrigued, why do you need to have to mark each side's smoke? The markers sit on the base and move with the ship.
If the the ship has no smoke markers, it's loaded and ready to fire. If it has white smoke markers, it just fired. If you flip the white over to the brown side and keep it with the ship,you are reloading and can't fire.
This keeps your gun loading/firing reference markers in your center of attention on the battlefield, instead of looking back toward your status board and then back on to the battlefield. This will reduce confusion and error, like a heads up display keeps a fighter pilot from looking down at his cockpit.

Cmmdre
11-02-2013, 11:08
We used the white side to mark that a ship fired in a given round, and then flipped it to the brown side at the end of the round. During the following turn, it was clear which ships were reloading and unable to fire because they had the brown smoke markers attached to them. We found this easier and more memorable than having to keep track of ammo on the ship mats. Again, this was with a demo kit and an incomplete set of gaming equipment. I think we will continue to use the smoke markers this way when the game is actually received, because when looking at the playing surface to see how to plan moves, firing information is readily available. We will use the ship mats to record what type of ammo is loaded, as many of us have entered the age of forgetfulness.


If the the ship has no smoke markers, it's loaded and ready to fire. If it has white smoke markers, it just fired. If you flip the white over to the brown side and keep it with the ship,you are reloading and can't fire.
This keeps your gun loading/firing reference markers in your center of attention on the battlefield, instead of looking back toward your status board and then back on to the battlefield. This will reduce confusion and error, like a heads up display keeps a fighter pilot from looking down at his cockpit.

Good advice for remembering and keeping a smooth running game.

Beowulf03809
11-06-2013, 10:40
It is an interesting idea to have the smoke markers flipped like that, but does it detract visibly from the game or add any extra complexity to movement when you have to move the smoke marker around with you? Just curious.

7eat51
11-06-2013, 10:43
It is an interesting idea to have the smoke markers flipped like that, but does it detract visibly from the game or add any extra complexity to movement when you have to move the smoke marker around with you? Just curious.

I don't think we found it distracting at all. We had the counters on the base, and any inconvenience from having to pick them up to calculate wind attitude was more than compensated by the ease with which reloading and knowing which ships could fire were being tracked.

Beowulf03809
11-06-2013, 11:15
Thanks! :salute:

The Royal Hajj
11-11-2013, 09:26
Humm, perhaps I'll have to paint both sides of my smoke markers. One a white/light grey for just fired, and one perhaps blue for reloading. The blue should look better than just the brown paper in any event.

7eat51
11-11-2013, 20:04
Brown can be very appropriate, as it would be a prevalent color when coming alongside a loaded enemy broadside while your crew is still loading your own guns.

Andy Blozinski
11-11-2013, 22:10
Brown can be very appropriate, as it would be a prevalent color when coming alongside a loaded enemy broadside while your crew is still loading your own guns.
Yeah, I think I'd like brown more than blue. Either that or a grey dark enough to be obviously different than white. Blue runs the risk of looking even more game token fake.

The Royal Hajj
11-12-2013, 07:24
The issue we may run into with just using the brown paper backing is... is will not always be a "clean" brown. Most of the time it actually has blue writing and logos all over it. Not very attractive looking when cut in to the smaller cloud shapes. lol A darker grey could work quite well too.

Or paint some licks of flames in to the firing side and leave the back just painted smoke...

7eat51
11-12-2013, 07:40
As you say, maybe a bit of orangish color along the edge closest to the ship on the firing side to differentiate it from the backside, assuming both sides being white/gray. Another option is to outline the front (just fired) side with black, as some of the pictures have shown. The backside can be free of outline, which in one way could look like the smoke is dissipating a bit.

Cool Breeze
11-17-2013, 09:45
I'm thinking of just taking a sharpie and putting black dots on the outer edge of one side for just fired with light grey whooshing tendrils trailing back to the inner edge so it appears cannon-balls are in flight. I'll try it out on a paper cutout first to see if it looks cool or just plain dorky.

And yes, Annette and I found the smoke markers to be much cleaner and quicker visually and game-flow-wise for reloading status. Less likely to be forgotten by the players to change each turn.

Andy Blozinski
12-01-2013, 00:02
One problem I had with (10) ships and (9) players is that I was clueless as to who's ship was who's. I couldn't keep track, but the players seemed to be OK with keeping track of their one ship. When I run my Godzilla game, I replaced all the cardboard markers with color coded dice as markers and it's easy to cross identify the markers to the monster by color. I'm contemplating doing similar color cross referencing for the ships, but not with the counters. I've noticed several gamers using little colored circles of what looked similar to pipe cleaner material in other games to mark casualties on multi-figure stands. I could use a different color circle on the center mast of every ship, then put a color coordinating marker circle in the center of their ship mat.

7eat51
12-01-2013, 00:32
Andy, how do you think placing some sort of mark on the ship's base and ship mat would work, something that can be on all four sides of the base, visible from any direction?

I had the same clueless feeling in the larger game I ran.

Andy Blozinski
12-01-2013, 01:19
Andy, how do you think placing some sort of mark on the ship's base and ship mat would work, something that can be on all four sides of the base, visible from any direction?

I had the same clueless feeling in the larger game I ran.

You could paint a colored tick mark on each side of the base. I'm already going to paint half my bases dark sea green to differentiate conflicting sides in the battle.

7eat51
12-01-2013, 01:32
That is a good idea. One of the comments I heard from players was that they liked the Pirates of the Spanish Main ships I used as merchants because they were readily identifiable as either targets or ships to be protected. I think when it comes to con games, it is important to remember that some of the players won't be able to readily identify ships, especially when mid-table of a larger playing surface. The different base colors to differentiate sides would address this quite nicely.

Berthier
12-01-2013, 02:09
What about adding a coloured pennant to each ship and a disc of matching colour on the card?

Gunner
12-01-2013, 02:24
What about adding a coloured pennant to each ship and a disc of matching colour on the card?

The colored pennant on a small pin stuck on top of a mast sounds like the best idea to me. the pin could be removed at the end of the game.

Nightmoss
12-01-2013, 10:21
The colored pennant on a small pin stuck on top of a mast sounds like the best idea to me. the pin could be removed at the end of the game.

Sounds like a great after market product for Keith to investigate (a set of colored pennants and pins)?

Gunner
12-01-2013, 13:39
Sounds like a great after market product for Keith to investigate (a set of colored pennants and pins)?

I 'd rather buy them from Keith but, if he doesn't, I know I'll make my own.